Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome to the cadence beat this is the podcast where we talk about all the cool things you can do with WordPress and Cadence. I'm here with Hannah Rittner and Ben Rittner. How are you guys doing today?
[00:00:13] Speaker B: Hi. Doing good.
[00:00:17] Speaker A: Awesome. It's almost the end of September, almost October, and we are in the full swing of things. It is crazy busy right now. Are you noticing lots going on in the Cadence world?
[00:00:28] Speaker B: Yes, so much.
[00:00:30] Speaker A: So much.
[00:00:32] Speaker C: I've even noticed there's a level of anxiety about everything that's happening and that I've got my hands in all these pieces that's increased to where even last night talking to my wife, and I was like, wow, I'm feeling it more than usual. Of, man, there's so many plates spinning right now. Which is exciting, because there's just something about coming into Fall, and we got to get this stuff done before the end of the year. There's this emphasis on let's really end strong, which is great, and it also just happens that a lot of stuff we've been working on is coming to the front of even in the whole stellar verse of our brands, there's a lot about to this is Fall. This is go.
[00:01:19] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:01:20] Speaker A: Yeah, it's go time. And I'm noticing it. Hannah, are you noticing it with the community, too? With everybody's projects that they're working? Like, our group is just hopping. So many new people coming in, so.
[00:01:33] Speaker B: Many new people coming into the group, and so many questions being asked, which is amazing. Our community is growing so much right now, and I feel like it's never had a lull, but now it's, oh, wow. Every time I'm on, I'm entering, allowing, like, ten new people in. I'm like, oh, my gosh, it's fun. It's exciting, but that you do feel this energy in the air. Everyone's just trying to yeah, it's fun. It's exciting.
[00:01:57] Speaker A: It's very exciting. So I know a lot of there's new stuff happening with Cadence too, both with Blocks as well as AI. And do you want to save that towards the end where we can talk about all of this new stuff that's happening and maybe talk about some useful, helpful advice for people who are working on all of their projects first? Do you want to take that first?
[00:02:19] Speaker C: Yeah, I think you could preface that with, like, when you're developing, you're going through a lot of decisions, and Cadence, as a tool, is designed to empower you to make effective websites in lots of different ways, and to empower you to do that also empowers you to make ineffective or bad decisions. And so we want to work through some of the tools we have that are like, yeah, they're there, and why you would use them in some cases and not in others. And I think it just is interesting guidelines for, like, when you're going through, you're not just saying, oh, because this tool exists, I should use it, or, Because I have this content, I should put it here, and more of want to be really intentional about the decisions I make on my site to make it effective for visitors.
[00:03:08] Speaker A: So are you telling me that I shouldn't put 75 lottie animations on a page?
[00:03:14] Speaker B: Yeah, but animations look great and they're so fun.
[00:03:21] Speaker A: They are great and they are fun, but maybe you could take that one as an option because I know there's tons of different animations that and animations are really hot right now. I'm noticing like, when I'm browsing around on the web with a newer site, there's a lot of movement happening. What are some things that people need to keep in mind when they're adding either a lottie animation or animate on scroll, like those types of things? Is there like a mindset of thinking about adding animation?
[00:03:49] Speaker C: Yeah, I think there's a mindset of one. You want to think about accessibility in terms of is this going to confuse is going to be so much that it makes people lose the train of the story you're trying to tell on your site and is it accessible in the sense of is the focusing happening to the right next thing you're tabing through your content? All that kind of stuff.
When you bring in animation, making sure that things that people are going to interact with don't move on them, that's one of the most frustrating things is like you go to click on something and it moved right before you did and you clicked on something else. Venmo has that issue drives me crazy. If you ever send someone something on Venmo and you want to change the privacy settings, it will appear in one place and right before you go to click on it, it'll move up because they put in something. It's like consistent for me anyway.
Yeah, but that's the kind of things you want to make sure you're paying attention to. And then too, animations can look really great on desktop and then fall apart on mobile. So making sure you're really paying attention to like, how's this going to affect the majority of viewers who are seeing this on mobile versus desktop? Yeah, there's a lot to consider as an overall thing, as like a basic thing. The real reason to put animation into your site is it creates a feeling for people and invoking feeling about your content is really powerful. So if you use it really wisely and really well, it can be a very powerful, oh, I got a sense of there's something really professional or really above and beyond about this because there was this really smooth, really intentional animation that was a part of the page. And so just that kind of stuff.
There's no hard fast, like only use three animations on a page or something like that. But I think in general, I would say don't use it just because get your site figured out and then go, what is something I could do to just make this subtle pop and feeling happen. And that's a better way to approach animation in general, is figure out my static site. Let's figure out what my content, the story that I'm trying to tell from section to section and then go, what would make this just pop a little bit more? And then work on putting that in.
[00:06:18] Speaker B: Yeah, that's great perspective, because it's so easy to have a fun tool and to start there when you're building a site or a page, rather than, okay, actually, what's the purpose of this, and what do I need to have here? Instead of just like, oh, I really want to add this to a page, so let me just add it first, and then it doesn't work that way. I'm guilty of that.
[00:06:40] Speaker A: I really like the experience of animate on scroll because it's like an immediate even just a subtle animate on scroll. It's like this immediate, oh, you're still with me. Have some movement, like, just real subtle light. Oh, you're still with me. Here's some feedback for you. It's just like this unconscious, like, we're still with you, too. It's like this engaging experience of, like, you're going through the site, you're sticking with it, and we're here, too. We're with you. And I like that, but it has to be I don't like it, like, super fast. I like it super subtle.
[00:07:15] Speaker C: Yeah, it's really important with a lot of that stuff, too, that you're careful with the delays that you add and stuff like that. Because someone will scroll through your site fast and you don't want them to miss something because you have half second delay before it fades in and they scrolled right past that section and were like, oh, this page is empty or that's missing a headline because the headline is going to fade in a half second. So you got to be careful. But it is. As far as with Cadence Tools, it's your easiest way to add that element of pop without having to dive into the world of lottie. And how do I create animations or figuring out all the different ways that you can do different types of animations with graphics and things like that?
[00:07:55] Speaker A: Yeah, really great points. And I love the fact that with the Cadence Tools, you can test these things. You can make a quick change and see does that change the conversions for that page when I change these animations and you don't need the team of developers to have to change the JavaScript or change whatever CSS is happening, all that crazy stuff, you don't need to worry about. You can just get into the site, change something, and then go look at your analytics. Did this change anything in terms of how my customers are using the site? Just that no code fast way of being able to see how things are working. What other things do people do when they're trying to really I know there's a lot of people right now who are working on their sites for Black Friday or Cyber Monday. They're trying to get their sales pages up. And so there's this temptation of, I want to really make this page pop. What are some things that you've seen people doing that could be done just a little better?
[00:08:52] Speaker B: Too many pop ups. Yeah, right away, like, you enter the site and boom, there's like a pop up, and you're like, I don't even know where I am. And then you exit that one, and then there's a slide in, and then there's just too much going on. And you can't even engage in what the actual website is selling because you're too bombarded by them trying to get your email so that they can give you 10% off. And it's just tough.
[00:09:17] Speaker A: And big brands do that too, don't they?
[00:09:20] Speaker B: Do?
[00:09:22] Speaker C: Yeah. It's interesting, but you see it all the time and yeah, it's like a quick way to just don't overwhelm the user. When you've got a message, focus on the message that you're trying to say. And so I think along with that is don't hide your main selling point in a pop up. If you're like, I really want to promote this sale, and you created a sales page for it, and people are landing on your home page. And don't add the pop up to be like, go to my sales page or anything like that. Transform your home page to be that. Duplicate your page. Make your home if that's where people are coming in, make that your sales page.
Don't be like, pop up, hey, we're having this sale. Come check it out. Just really focus on the user coming in. And there's reasons to have a sales page for sure, if you're doing marketing campaigns and you want to bring them into a sales page versus your home page. But even when you're thinking through, like, how do I get this sale up and visible to my users, using pop ups is not the right option. Put it into the content itself. Make it part of the design. So that way, because so many people are just going to close that pop up before they read it because it's, like, annoying.
[00:10:40] Speaker A: Yeah. The only time I like pop ups or can excuse a pop up if I'm a user is on exit intent, I'm going to leave the page, and they're like, Hold it right there. We've got this special offer for you. But I think a lot of big brands do this kind of stuff, too, where it's just like, okay, I just want to take a little break. I'm just going to go look at William Sonoma and reimagine my kitchen right as, like, my little fantasy world. And then boom. Pop. Like, I haven't even looked at anything yet, and already it's there, and it just interrupts that experience. But I think a lot of times people are coming into a website from an ad or maybe they're coming from a Google search, make sure that wherever they're coming from, that you at least satisfy that search intent that need, that whatever's bringing them to your doorstep. If it's a trick or treater, give them their candy, right? Give them what they came for before you start talking to them about something else completely. Or establishing this long relationship of an email. Thinking about your audience of where they're coming from and how they arrive on your site is really important too.
[00:11:45] Speaker B: There's certainly a time and place for pop ups, but I don't think it's within 3 seconds of entering a website.
But it seems to be working for somebody because so many people do it.
[00:11:58] Speaker C: And I get you want to make noise to draw attention to certain areas. There's going to be times where you're like, I really need people to see this because they're not seeing it. And there's a lot of ways you can do that. And pop ups is one, you can do a slide in, which is a little less intrusive because it's not preventing that person from scrolling and all that. That's a little bit nicer. And then design, like use design. If your website is mostly blue and white, pull in a big orange banner and that will be noticed. Like use color, use design. This is like one of those things like Cadence gives you the ability to use a Google Font. There's like 900 plus Google Fonts, so you can in an instant pick a Google Font and drop it into your site. And that's really powerful and it can be abused very quickly because you could have ten different fonts loading, which is going to slow your site down and just be really weird for the user to be like, why are so many different font families just going to feel like it wasn't thought out and well planned out? So you don't want to go just using fonts like crazy and mismatching and not having this brand style, but at the same time, there are some really loud fonts that can be very good attention getters. If you're like, hey, I want to draw attention to this section. It can be a powerful tool to bring in a whole new font family for that section and drop that in. And what's great is with Cadence, like, if you're just doing that on one page, that's the only page that that font family is going to load. So you're still not bogging down your site with a bunch of different font families and you've got a powerful way to get attention to a section. So it can be fun to do. Go look at all the loud fonts on Google Fonts and be like, OOH, I could use this.
And just even the word sale or whatever with a loud font is very attention.
[00:13:50] Speaker A: Yeah, definitely good advice there. What other things do you guys see that look, can we talk carousels and sliders? Because people love them.
It feels like something like, I can, okay, I don't know what I want in this hero area, but I want three things. Can I just have three things like sliding along? And I see all of this advice out there. Don't do that. It's too confusing, it's too cluttered, it doesn't work. What are your thoughts? Do you guys have any feelings about carousels, sliders, those types of things?
[00:14:21] Speaker C: Lots of feelings, for sure. I think the general rule should be don't. And then there's always exceptions to the rules. There's always times to do different things. But I would say don't default to being like, I need to create a slider for my home page hero section. That is three slides.
Try, really try to think about how do I make my hero section on my home page super easy to consume and that it allows the person to really understand what I offer. What is in exchange here? Like, you're giving your very quick pitch of you should stay on this site because you're going to get this, and this is how we offer it to you. And then I think you figure it out from there as to there's sometimes where you can say, and again, this is the exception, but there are times when you can add a slider to have different hero points to talk about your services in different ways. And I would say in general, that's been proven to not work that well. That's not to say it can't work. You don't want to hide your main services behind a slide that requires the user to hang out long enough for an auto slide to happen, which ideally don't auto slide. Just try, really try not to auto slide or having them interact with the page. There's times for it. We use tabs a lot, and you can think of a slider a little bit like a tab system. It's just the way in which you navigate is a little bit different. In general, we all know how to navigate sliders. We know what an arrow means and things like that. You can go too far and be like the fact that you use a slider means you are a garbage web developer.
I've seen some cases where it can work. I just think in general, for most people, they're not trusting in their main marketing message and they're trying to create multiple marketing messages and using a slider to do that. And I would say that's probably not the right way to use a slider.
[00:16:24] Speaker A: There's some businesses, like if you think about like Lyft or Airbnb or Uber, there's a couple of distinct customer audiences that those types of businesses have because they're primarily connecting rides or a place to stay with someone who's got that's their service right. So they have two very distinct audiences. And I look at those sites, they don't have sliders. They have very distinct here's the rider, here's the driver, and, hey, driver, we need you guys. There's much more of a handling all of the objections of safety and miles on my car and all of that stuff. Pages that are very targeted to one specific audience type and then the general site, which is more like riders, because there's more riders than there are drivers that they're connecting with, but there's no page that's trying to address all of those audiences at once. One page is for drivers, one page is for riders. And it's very clear calls to action to do that one thing rather than one page, like a home page, where it's really tempting. I've got these two very distinct audiences. How do I communicate to both of them? They're coming in, and they do it through navigation. There's, like, drivers, riders right at the top, and if you click on drivers, that page looks completely different, like, than the rest of the site. They're squeezing you into making that decision to become a driver. But it's very one page has one intentional message. And I think the temptation is when you have a lot of different audiences, to want to try to squeeze all of those things in one page, and a slider feels like maybe the right way to do it.
[00:18:07] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:18:09] Speaker C: You could say, if you're thinking through some good ways to use sliders and stuff, think about testimonial carousels as like a really easy one, because they're not missing that. There's testimonials, and you're just providing a way to show more than one or two on a page where they don't have to navigate to a new page by just clicking the arrow. So there's use cases there where it's not at the top of the screen, so it's not really annoying when they're coming in and you can scroll down and you allow the user to engage with that section and get more content about a certain thing that you're talking about. I want to see more of those, or I could see it work with products where you're like, here's some of our featured products, and you want to allow them to oh, I want to engage, especially if you don't auto scroll on that, too. It's just a really nice, oh, I want to see a couple more of these highlighted products for this, or content like that, where it's let's engage further in what I'm already showing you, but you got the gist of it. But if you want to go a little further without navigating to another page, here's a way to do it. That's a powerful way to use a carousel. And two, when you've got testimonials in a carousel like that, you can still only have four testimonials, but you show two and you have a slider, and people feel like you have 100 because they don't like you on auto loops. They don't think about the fact that there's still only four testimonials. There they think, wow, this company has so many testimonials, they need to make a slider for it. There's that feeling. And even though there's only four, it's just a good way to get a sense of we have unlimited testimonials to show you without having to go and have unlimited testimonials. So it's like it's just a powerful way to, hey, we have recommendations coming at you and it's not oh, weird. Why do they only have one recommendation?
[00:19:51] Speaker B: Yeah. And for those who are creating websites, you don't need to have 120 testimonials. No, I just remember in support, people like messaging, like, why does my carousel tap out at 120 images? And we're like, Wait, back up. Your carousel doesn't need 120 images. Please don't do that.
[00:20:11] Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. I'm fine. If you have a page that you're like, hey, I want to have a review wall. That's like a bunch of testimonials, but don't put more than story brand, scroll story brand. I think their big thing is three.
You only need three and just work on making those the best three you can.
[00:20:36] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:20:36] Speaker C: And that's one of the tricks that they talk about, is find the customers that have had success with you or the users or whatever you're doing and selling, and then write the testimonial for them that has the language and the message that you want. And then go to that person and say, hey, would you put your name on this testimonial? Because if you're someone who uses a product, you don't want to hear, hey, will you write us testimonial? Because you're like, I got to figure out the words and what to say and all that stuff, but you like the product, and so if they come to you and say, hey, will you put your name on this? And the wording sounds right, and you're like, yeah, that's my experience. You'll put your name on it and you'll get a lot more very good testimonials that way than just putting it out there to people to be like, please write a review for me, or Would you write a review? A lot of people are going to not write a good enough review or ramble or just not write the review. They just time they're busy. They got sidetracked. So if you write the reviews for your weird but write the review and then ask them to sign off on it, and you will get really rich reviews for whatever you're doing.
[00:21:42] Speaker A: And if somebody does write you a review, that is something that you haven't even solicited and that just shows up, buy that person a gift basket for Christmas, maybe, because somebody going above and right?
[00:21:54] Speaker C: Yes, absolutely. For sure.
[00:21:58] Speaker A: Yeah. Cool. Hannah, anything else? That people are using? A very effective technique, but maybe can be using it a little bit better.
[00:22:10] Speaker B: I feel like we've touched on some of the big ones. I think another one that just I have a hard time with is poor design and just, like, fonts that don't match colors that don't look good together when you open up a page, is it pleasing to the eye, or is it just too much happening at one time? We've been releasing on the blog every month these design techniques, and they've been interesting. Like, lots of very unique things that are, like, trends that are happening, design trends. And that's inspirational to click through those and see, oh, that's actually something that I wouldn't have thought of, but that's a cool look. So if you need some inspiration, we've been posting blog posts about that. But also, I just think you can really go wrong by adding in poor colors, poor fonts that just don't match.
[00:22:58] Speaker A: Yeah, it's good to I think, at the beginning, commit to a couple of fonts, headline font and a body font, and then use that Cadence color palette to really make some core decisions about what your brand is going to look like, what your brand colors are, and then stick with it. And then there's the exceptions.
Every once in a while, just don't go off and live in exception land.
[00:23:25] Speaker B: Totally.
[00:23:26] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:23:28] Speaker A: I can tell that you guys are like me, that you'll start looking at a website and immediately start wondering how'd they do this and how'd they do that. And I wonder aura ring, those rings that are like the tracker, like sleep tracking. People use them for their website, their homepage. When you scroll through that and then they start talking about sleep, it gets dark. Oh, you're sleeping now. It is such a beautiful site.
I'll just go on it and just now, this is a landing page. It's so beautiful.
[00:24:00] Speaker B: That's awesome.
[00:24:01] Speaker A: That's my new favorite one that I've been poking at. Not that I'm going to get an aura ring, but I love that's. Great.
Let's talk about what's new with Cadence. Hannah, we've got so much going on with community stuff and stuff that's coming up.
We're so busy. What's up?
[00:24:20] Speaker B: So busy. The thing I'm most excited about is that we just launched the Cadence Marketplace, which we've been working on for a long time. And basically it is a collective from designers and web creators. And it's all of their design templates and starter templates and child themes and expertise. And it's all in one beautiful place, and anybody can access it, and they can purchase from these people. And it's amazing. It's, like an amazing thing that's built by our community, but for our community to help people get the most out of the Cadence. And I'm just so excited about it.
[00:24:56] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm so excited about it, too, because every once in a while, like we were talking about, we go into the Cadence group, and it's a, wow, there's a new design library. And here's another. And it's getting to the point where we really need to have one place where people can evaluate all of the different child themes and the design libraries, the block collections and everything. And then we've got tons of people who ask us all the time, like, who is a Cadence expert? Somebody who works with Cadence all the time. We've got a few people that we know, but maybe we've got more. So how do people submit their work.
[00:25:30] Speaker B: On the Marketplace page? There is a link at the bottom, and you can just fill out the form and enter your information, upload your libraries. And then you can also be in our marketplace so everybody can find you.
[00:25:42] Speaker A: Super exciting. And we'll have links in the show notes and the description box if you're watching on YouTube so that you can go check out the marketplace and see what's there. And we have more stuff coming up within the community, too. What else is happening?
[00:25:56] Speaker B: Yes, we also are having our second Cadence amplify. We actually pushed the date back. We were going to do it this month, and there's a ton going on. So we have a new date October 20, which is Friday. We were going to do it today, and no problem. October 20 is a much better day.
Yes, Friday. It'll be all day. We'll have two tracks very similar to last time. We've got some great speakers lined up. Jake Full will be with us. Adam Pricer will be with us from WP Crafter and a couple other people that we're just super excited about. So definitely put that date on your calendar. And we'll have a schedule. Actually, the schedule should be out now. By the time you're listening to this podcast, there should be a schedule release. Super excited.
[00:26:39] Speaker A: Yeah. Description box below. Save the date. Really interesting speakers about everything that helps you make a better WordPress website. It's not just about Cadence, but there are some Cadence related talks. But we've got some Rachel Winchester, who's going to be talking about UX. Brandy Lawson, who is one of my dear friends and just released a book, and she was the keynote speaker at Word Camp Phoenix. Couple 2020 maybe.
Brilliant person, and she just released a book. She's going to talk about Scope Creep, that evil, horrible thing that makes your projects just turn into monsters. We're going to kill the Scope creep.
[00:27:20] Speaker B: Love it.
[00:27:20] Speaker A: That's what it is about. And so excited about Brandy because she's amazing.
[00:27:26] Speaker C: It is a constant.
[00:27:30] Speaker A: Is Brandy's amazing? I'm just going to talk her up a little bit. I will just tell you everything I know about Google Analytics I learned from Brandy. I'm excited about Brandy. Can you tell?
[00:27:41] Speaker C: It's awesome.
[00:27:42] Speaker B: I love it.
[00:27:43] Speaker A: It's going to be so cool. I am so excited. I am so excited.
It's just going to be so much fun. And we haven't even talked about all the new stuff with Cadence, and look at how excited I am already. But Ben, you just released Cadence Blocks, some new features this week. What are people playing with?
[00:28:01] Speaker C: Yeah, so. Yeah, we did conditional fields for the advanced form block. And that's really powerful, allowing you to basically have one field determine if another field should show further down in your form. So that was like phase one of new enhancements for the advanced form block, and we're really excited about the future of that. Then there's the Progress bar. Got a new feature which allows you to do masking, so you can do shape masks. That animate in as you set the amount you want to animate in. So it's a really cool way to do something like as simple as a rating, star rating, where you can put like 4.7 and it'll animate up to 4.7 of the stars, but it allows you to do custom masking as well. And that opens up a huge door of really interesting things where you can create custom shapes that you iterate over and over or just have one that you want to fill out. So, yeah, that's cool with the Progress Bar. And then we released Pexels Integration into the media library. So if you want to very quickly and easily search Pexels for an image that you want to be able to drop into your content, you're writing a blog post, whatever. This makes it super quick. Go to the Media Library, click on Pexels, do a search, choose the one you want, or multiple. You drop them into your site. They already come in sized for web, and they already have alt text, and the image file is using that alt text as well. So you get like an actual good SEO image file name, and then you can drop that right into your page and away you go. And it's quick and easy and yeah, it's one of my more favorite things we've done because it just seems like there's a lot of times where I'm like, I need an image and I can just go grab one quickly. Really fun.
[00:29:51] Speaker A: It's so cool. The Pexels thing is so much fun when you're building out using the design library and it comes in with sort of that soon it'll be all the AI stuff, right? But right now it's coming in with those placeholders and you just click on them, go to Pixels and immediately replace them. I did a couple of quickie, like, little demos with it. It makes building out a landing page so fast. Just having that Poxels integration, like right there to find the perfect image for all of these places that the design library is holding space for you to make those kinds of decisions. It's so much fun. So I'm having a blast with it already. It's only been out in a few days. So very cool. And I have to ask about AI because people ask all the time.
[00:30:34] Speaker C: Yeah, I think the main reason that AI is not out right now is that the licensing and credit system that we're putting behind it is just a monster amount of work to get that right, to be able to upgrade everyone into a system that allows for credit usage and all that stuff. But we're getting close and in the meantime, as we've gotten the inline and the ability to do sections, we're looking at full site and getting that fixed because we've done a lot of stuff with pages and a lot of stuff with full site. So we're getting close. So where we thought we'd be like launching sections and then inline and then full site. A lot of those things are coming together as we're also trying to figure out this whole credit system. But it's close. We don't have a date yet, but we're expecting it to be at least version one in the next month. No promises, but I think for sure it's super fun and you can join our beta and get access right now. Like we have users playing around with it. Go and join the waitlist and we can get you access to the plugin where you can actually play around with.
[00:31:39] Speaker A: It on your site and we will have a link to that waitlist down below. So next round of beta testing you can get in on that. So much fun. I've had so much fun playing with it.
The more you use it, the more you find like little because it's really AI only shows you it's almost like a mirror. It shows back to you what you have to give it, right? So if you're giving it tons of information, it can really hone in on what you're doing. And so it's definitely an exploratory. Explore. I'm having fun exploring.
Words are hard today.
I'm exploring it. It's fun. I can't wait for everybody else to have fun with it too.
[00:32:21] Speaker C: Yes.
[00:32:22] Speaker A: Anything else?
[00:32:22] Speaker B: We should talk about that's it.
[00:32:28] Speaker A: Just busy little beavers over here building all the things. Very fun. One thing that I will mention, I am going to be participating.
Maybe one of you guys will come with me. But on Wednesday. So just in a couple of days, if you're watching this or listening when it first comes out on Wednesday, I should just say a date. It would be the 27th in the afternoon for Americans. There is going to be a Flow themes Migration Master class that we'll be participating in because I know a lot of people from Flow themes are coming over to Cadence and so we're going to be there with welcome Arms. So we'll have a link to that in the show notes as well. If you know of someone who is curious about Cadence that is coming from the Flow themes world, we are here for them. So we'll just get the news out about that too. All right.
Another episode in the books and you thought we wouldn't get this far.
[00:33:27] Speaker B: Here we are.
[00:33:30] Speaker A: We'll talk to you guys next time.
[00:33:33] Speaker B: See ya.
Bye.
